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十三行 & Thirteen Factories

index … The Rise of Modern China by  Hsü (2000; 6th edition)

Two questions:

  1. Where were the hongs located exactly in Guangzhou?
  2. Where is/was “Thirteen Factories” coming from?

The more I read about this topic the more doubt I get on Thirteen Factories.

十三行 referred to Chinese designated trading firms with license, that allowed to import / export goods with foreign firms / traders. And the current so-called Thirteen Factories referred to the foreign companies, that served as living quarter as well as work place and office in their factory. Unlike the number of hongs, number of foreign companies was never an issue or used to identify them. Factory clearly meant to the foreign community, so 十三行 was NOT Thirteen Factories.  IF anything, I’d translate 十三行 to Thirteen Firms or Shops, def NOT factory (Chinese merchants didn’t live in their firms, did they?)

I also checked the index of the following books on hand (which I think it should have). And I’m wondering why they don’t, but instead they all have Russell & Company (except two):

  1. 1910 The Int’l Relations of the Chinese Empire 1834-60 by Hosea Morse
  2. 1964 Trade and Diplomacy on the China Coast: The opening of the treaty ports 1842-54, by John Fairbank
  3. 1975 The I.G. in Peking 1868-1907, by Robert Hart
  4. 1978 The Cambridge History of China  Vol 10, 1800-1911, part 1; ed. by Denis Twitchett & Fairbank
  5. 1984 The Empress of China by Philip Smith
  6. 1986 America’s China Trade in Historical Perspective, ed. Ernest May & Fairbank
  7. 1996 Letters from China, by Robert B. Forbes 1838-40
  8. 1992 The Immobile Empire 1792-94 by Alain Peyrefitte  neither  
  9. 2012 When America First met China by Eric Dolin Thirteen Factory St
  10. 2020 The Whites are Enemies of Heaven by Mark Driscoll
  11. 2015 China’s Foreign Places by Robert Nield
  12. 2018 Through American Eyes 1859-60, by George W Heard neither
index 

… my reasons of doubt:

  1. IF, Thirteen Factories had been a thing/name, shouldn’t these books have used it?
  2. Hsü’s The Rise of Modern China, explained the number 13 and footnoted it (p142), and wrote (p143) ‘Juxtaposed with the Thirteen Hongs were the thirteen foreign “factories,” or agencies, located outside …’  In the index, he listed Thirteen Hongs but beneath it, there isn’t Thirteen Factories. It was safe to say, there was no term Thirteen Factories. … so did the books I’ve listed above.
  3. Factory (外商的馆) in this matter, had their number ever totaled to 13? It might have been ‘juxtapose’ but it seemed the name just had grown and now stayed, wrongly?
  4. … that the scholarly circle had some tectonic shift on the term “Thirteen Factories” …  and I don’t know about (I’m an independent researcher …)

Google thirteen factories on Chrome

Google thirteen factories on Safari

这个是徐中约的 ‘中国近代史’ 的索引. 十三行 & Thirteen Factories (Thirteen Hongs)下面没有 英文普遍用的Thirteen Factories.

我觉得英文的翻译Thirteen Factories不对. 所以才有以上和您的对话.
我怀疑的理由:
1. 如果徐也用Thirteen Factories 那么应该在13行的下面. 但是没有. 他使用的13 完全是指🇨🇳华商.
2. 英文的 Factory / Factories 是指 外商的馆 他们的数量从来都不是个事 (?) 对不对?
3. 广州那个’13行区’也是指中国商家 是不是? 英文翻译也不应该用 Factories
4. 有可能我啥都不懂 … 自找烦恼 (?)

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